Motor storage - Northern Colorado Rocketry

This topic has 43 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated 18 years, 2 months ago by James Russell.

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November 6, 2007 at 5:38 pm #45553
Warren B. Musselman
Moderator
Are you saying that there is a completely separate set of permits and a test required by the STATE in addition to the BATFE LEUP?

Warren
November 6, 2007 at 7:09 pm #45554
Mike Bennett
Yes there always has been at least in Colorado. It is even stated on the federal permit that you follow all state and local laws to have a federal LEUP. Colorado requires type 1, 2 and 3 permits to possess, transport and store hobby rocket motors.
November 6, 2007 at 7:13 pm #45555
Conway Stevens
Participant
Actually I just spoke with Scott from the state. For hobby rocket motors yes you do fall under a business since they do not recognize individuals. Also for possession, storage and transport of rocket motors you do need the type 1 (possession), 2 (transport) and 3 (storage) permits at $75.00 each for a total of $225. Next you need a finger print card and you have to take a test. Scott said that it was 33 questions and would cover mostly low explosive questions. You have to get a 90% or better to pass. At that point he takes your picture and inpects your magazine. Then hopefully in a short time if the background check checks out then you get your state permits.
I am getting the applications for all three permits and he is sending me the documents from which the test questions come from to study. There is not other cost like the $600 you stated for taking the test. I know when Ken took his test he bought a book for $300 to study but I think they are being leaniant on test questions for rocket motor storage. I will find out when I get the materials from Scott.

Mike, Its good to hear that the things stated to me are not at all as made to be from my info. Trust me. It had me spooked. Now not that its any better to have to spend that much more to be in compliance. But I can live with that. So to get the study info for the test In just need to contact Scott I assume? I wonder if there is anothere fee for Dealers to sell. Wouldnt doubt it. But Thats better and a bit more live-able then I thought. Thanks for the foot work Mike.
November 6, 2007 at 7:20 pm #45556
Conway Stevens
Participant
Are you saying that there is a completely separate set of permits and a test required by the STATE in addition to the BATFE LEUP?

Warren

Yep has always been. BUT the ATFE does not enforce for the local. Only Fed. They can work with the local to make sure you have it as well. I can remember long ago at several Anual meetings having Jim Amos Explain this and what a stickler it is. I guess its all part of the fun..

After doing some thinking personally about our law suit.. Im glad Ive gone this way for the process. Ive learned lots as well as I have some personal thoughts about the ifs and or buts. Besides to buy chemicals its starting to get to where a permit is required.. We will see. I have my beliefs about whats to come..
November 6, 2007 at 7:59 pm #45557
Warren B. Musselman
Moderator
It’s a sad thing all this buearacracy and fees. Just another reason why I will never get a LEUP. I’ll continue to pay for “flight services” from onsite vendors unless and until the rules tighten further.

W
November 6, 2007 at 9:06 pm #45558
Ken Plattner
Participant
Warren, I could be wrong (I hope not) but I believe the state permits only apply to manufacture, storage and transportation of propellant. A LEUP with contingency storage does not require state permits.

Ken.
November 6, 2007 at 9:29 pm #45559
Mike Bennett
It’s a sad thing all this buearacracy and fees. Just another reason why I will never get a LEUP. I’ll continue to pay for “flight services” from onsite vendors unless and until the rules tighten further.

W

This is a good way to go for most flyer’s. I on the other hand make my own propellant. I see the need whether we win the lawsuit or not as being a necessity to have both state and federal permits and being fully legal. I have my own storage and it close so for me…well…I’m ok with it.
November 7, 2007 at 4:11 am #45560
Conway Stevens
Participant
Actually I just spoke with Scott from the state. For hobby rocket motors yes you do fall under a business since they do not recognize individuals. Also for possession, storage and transport of rocket motors you do need the type 1 (possession), 2 (transport) and 3 (storage) permits at $75.00 each for a total of $225. Next you need a finger print card and you have to take a test. Scott said that it was 33 questions and would cover mostly low explosive questions. You have to get a 90% or better to pass. At that point he takes your picture and inpects your magazine. Then hopefully in a short time if the background check checks out then you get your state permits.

Mike and all, After taking time to look at things I find it interesting they have a permit for possession, Beings if you get or have the permits for storage and transportation wouldnt that mean you would already have to possess it? Kinda duh as far as I see for a possession permit. Kinda sounds like a not necessary permit if you qualify for the others. I still belive that if we are going to have to have a State permit we need to all get something going and get this more in the direction we need. It should be equal to the requirements or level of stuff the feds are doing not more. No test, Lower fees. A single Fee. Something with us in mind. Anyhow.. Hey Mike how long are the permits good for? What does it cost to renew? does one have to retake the test? Just curious if you found out any of that info.

Conway
November 7, 2007 at 4:16 am #45561
Conway Stevens
Participant
Warren, I could be wrong (I hope not) but I believe the state permits only apply to manufacture, storage and transportation of propellant. A LEUP with contingency storage does not require state permits.

Ken.

Ken actually its not to do with just any of that. ALL explosives be it blasting High or low or anything all fall under the same state permit. Weather its business or manufacture or just personal. Its all lumped into one. Thats one of my and others issues with it. We should not have to do all the stuff they have for the other items requiring permits. Its excessive. But without it you are in violation of state law. It doesnt matter if its contingent storage or not. You will ship it, Transport it to the site use it in state and store it somewhere even if not your storage.. Thats what they see.
November 7, 2007 at 4:28 am #45562
Mike Bennett
Permits are good for 3 years just like the fed permit. The reason for all the different permits is like I said before you are looked at as being a business, They do not recognize an individual user. Scott did make it sound like they understand hobby rocket motors and maybe the test was/is changed or geared towards low explosives. I don’t believe you have to retake the test unless you fail an inspection or get a violation. More information can be found here and I suggest you read: http://oil.cdle.state.co.us/Public%20Safety/frequent_questions.asp#Explosives
Manufacture or dealer is covered under all all the permits. contact info and mail address for state applications are on the web site listed above.

By the way for those of you who have just a federal LEUP and not the state permit, Jeff C from the BATFE who did my interview did tell me that I would need a Colorado type 1,2 and 3 permits. Which means they know about the Colorado State law and the need to have the state permits in order to have the federal one. He specifically asked if I had my state permits and it was one of the questions your are asked on a list of questions that you sign and date at the end of the interview so you know that you got asked the question and that you understood the question. He also hinted that the next time he did an inspection on my magazine that all my paperwork be in order including the proper state permits.
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